The Poolie Bunker

And today the government are to announce their plans to mitigate higher fuel bills, so obviously their policies do contribute to the price for us the consumers. Green levies, VAT, fuel duty, etc etc

from cynics are us when and if they fo that will depend on the cost of fuel at the pumps and if they deel they can get away with it without losing there voter.

They have also announced all new builds to have heat pumps and solar panels including plug in ones, no idea how they are going to work ?

They won’t….work
They’ll probably order the heat pumps from China …and Labours ‘secure’ energy equipment will in fact be worthless, as we don’t make wind turbines, solar panels and heat pumps but regrettably thenChinese do… so will in fact be supplied by the Chinese…as we don’t get our hands dirty anymore, because everyone’s got worthless degrees in ‘meeejia studies’ followed by a part time job burger flipping.

I was on about domestic fuel, electricity and gas. My point stands.

How wrong can you be? If VAT is 15% - the government cut is 15p per litre at £1 per litre. At £2 per litre their cut is 30p so the government have increased the cost by 15p. Therefore by having fixed VAT rates the government are directly increasing the cost and profiteering as a consequence of the fuel companies profiteering.

It's the same with the minimum wage increases. Every £1 The low paid get extra the government get 20 % in income tax, 8% NI from the employee and 15% NI from the employer. All paid for by the employee and the employer. No wonder they want to keep extending the freezing of the tax threshold. Talk about easy money. That's just part of the problem though. Having gleaned all this extra revenue they then dish it out to illegal invaders and the work shy.
We could be sympathetic with their money grabbing if they were putting it to good use.

There you go, the Irish government have announced reductions to duty on petrol and diesel to help alleviate the effect of the Iran war. This benefits individuals and businesses and reduces inflationary pressures.
But our government are quite happy to take in the extra tax and drive more businesses to the wall, increase inflationary pressure and give the extra money to the dinghy folks and the workshy.

Reeves has announced there will support for the most vulnerable people, those on benefits, will that include pensioners as The State Pension is a benefit ?
As far as a cut in fuel duty there is more chance of being struck by lightening, it should be utility companies massive profits she should hitting.

Correct me if I am wrong PTID, VAT on petrol is 20% and 5% on gas and electricity, the government have no control what companies set the price of fuel, gas and electricity at, unfortunately if the companies raise the price they receive more VAT, it it falls they receive less, they can’t adjust VAT as when prices rise and fall, it’s not profiteering as the government are not raising the price.

The energy price cap is being reduced in April by around 7% meaning a cut in bills, unfortunately since the lunatic in the asylum decided to start an illegal war you can forget cuts in the future.

Pointless argument Derwent, an increase in anyone’s salary attracts more tax & NI, even the last increase in The State Pension pushes some people into the tax bracket. What needs to happen and it won’t is a rise in the income tax threshold that would put more money in people’s pockets.

Wether it's 15 or 20% isn't really the point though is it? They're raking in extra and could reduce VAT temporarily or as the Irish are doing they could reduce fuel duty.
And it's not just the vulnerable that needs help, business costs are going through the roof as a result of this and the NMW rise, lower NI thresholds, etc.
How many businesses will be pushed over the edge? Where do you think inflation is going to head? Starmer fiddles (in every sense of the word) as the UK burns.

Labour’s arse is bouncing along the bottom.
They have given up governing and decided to look after their core vote.
Simple as that, but a sign of rabid self preservation.

I’ll agree with raising the tax threshold Jamie, it should have been increased by the Tories years ago, but sadly all politicians like to greedily protect their money sources.

or is it a case of the government turning a blind eye to the increases of fuel at the pumps thats been in the country for months now as they are making a nice little earner with clean hands on top.

Happens every time, prices will be going up in the shops but crude oil is still circulating round the globe and hasn’t been processed, they take us for mugs every time.

It’s a hidden tax increase Snowy, they hope no one will notice.

Most arguments involving this government are pointless Jamie but they have to be made in my opinion, no matter how fruitless the outcome is in making them. I agree that the threshold needs to be increased but whilst it's present value remains the government's take will rise year on year. The only hope is that somehow they are forced to increase the threshold ( highly unlikely but you never know). That is why we have to continue with what you describe as pointless arguments and refuse to be gagged. I can't remember who but didn't some prominent figure once say "when they start calling your arguments pointless they are expressing their fear of them, so never be put off by such criticism" Not sure of the accuracy of the words in that but that was the point he was trying to get across. So I'll keep rattling on if that's alright with you.

That’s why I check these things in a way I never used to……it can’t be kept hidden.

Yeah. Fuck me! The energy price cap is being reduced BY WHAT THE GOVERNMENT HAVE DECIDED TO DO. Meaning the government DO HAVE CONTROL OVER GAS AND ELECTRIC prices. Are you able to keep your opinions static? You keep changing your POV.

I’ll say again Labour haven’t increased the price of fuel to increase revenue, they have no control over it.
Highest energy prices for years, UK governments don’t set energy prices it’s the privately owned foreign companies who do thanks to Thatchers sell offs.
[/quote]

Much as I hate to get involved, the above is wrong.

Governments do have a huge say in the price of fuel, by their laws, decisions, tax take, levies, granting licenses etc. In fact Jamie, you’ve contradicted yourself above, writing firstly that governments have “no control” then stating it’s Thatcher’s fault.[/quote]

Wrong, ok they control it through taxes but no government has increased the price of fuel since 2010, fuel and energy costs could have been lower if Thatcher hadn’t sold them off.
The last actual increase in UK fuel duty occurred in 2010. Since then, duty has been frozen at 57.95p per litre, and in 2022, it was temporarily cut to 52.95p. However, this 5p cut is set to end, with staged increases bringing it back up from September 2026, totaling a 5p rise by March 2027[/quote]

I was on about domestic fuel, electricity and gas. My point stands.[/quote]



The energy price cap is being reduced in April by around 7% meaning a cut in bills, unfortunately since the lunatic in the asylum decided to start an illegal war you can forget cuts in the future.[/quote]

Yeah. Fuck me! The energy price cap is being reduced BY WHAT THE GOVERNMENT HAVE DECIDED TO DO. Meaning the government DO HAVE CONTROL OVER GAS AND ELECTRIC prices. Are you able to keep your opinions static? You keep changing your POV.[/quote]

The UK energy price cap is controlled and set by Ofgem (the Office of Gas and Electricity Markets), which is the independent national regulator for Great Britain's gas and electricity markets. It limits the maximum amount energy suppliers can charge for default tariffs and is updated every three months
Ofgem (the Office of Gas and Electricity Markets) is an independent national regulatory authority, not directly controlled by the UK government in its day-to-day operations. As a "non-ministerial government department," it works within a legal framework set by Parliament to protect consumers, but it operates independently of ministerial interference

No it doesn’t. The price cuts in April are down to government policy. The government scrapped some Levees completely and moved another one into general taxation.

That would be the government.

The Irish Government have reduced fuel duty in response, our government are insistent on increasing it soon.

I’ll just carry on putting my £25 in the tank as needed. Some folk talk like it’s £25 a litre.

Seen some garages putting prices up twice in a day yet I'm pretty sure they had no fuel deliveries that day.

I don't need to tell anyone who owns the majority of UK petrols stations do I?

Who?

its been going on since the first shot was fired. any old excuse and the buggers will use it for the gods of profit.

Spill the beans S.P.

My Mitsubishi Ecodan heat pump was manufactured in Livingston where they make heat pumps for the UK and European market - and very good it is too.

How financially efficient is it Mr Splod.

Its good if your house is well insulated. Mine was a self build in 2019 and its well above building regs. Its also good to use a smart electricity tariff. I wouldn't recommend heat pumps for poorly insulated and draughty properties. Part of my savings was not having to pay for a gas connection. I think its a no-brainer for new properties to have heat pumps/solar/batteries.

Cheers.
Your last comment on the approach to new build I agree wholeheartedly. Been advocating that for long enough.

Of that I have no doubt, but it’ll be down to the accountants what’s bought, quality counts for nowt nowadays, mores the pity…..personally I’d like a choice, not a green edict.

We have all this rush to switch to green energy, does the U.K. have enough power sources to generate the electricity required ?
What happens when the next government decides nope, we are going to dril, drill, drill, will all the heat pumps be scrapped ?

No they don’t…..politicians stress the fuel security cobblers line, but as we depend on Chinese wind turbines and solar panels we have no security, they could shut us down easily…but politicians are naive.
No, they’re emphasising now that fact that no new petrol or diesel vehicles will be sold after 2030….even the EU’s stepping back on that one…the result will be cars become too expensive for a lot of people, I suspect we’ll get politicians who start to tighten up on petrol and diesel vehicles with more stringent MoT’s and taxation on fuel.

It’s like a religious cult this green thing.

What’s the point in us suffering if China, USA, Africa don’t join in.

Except for UK politicians to pat themselves on the back.

rather convert to islam than convert to green.

Just a thought, but why are we gas and electricity prices fluctuating so much when the government tells us that more than half our energy comes from renewables? They tell us that having our own renewables generating facilities will shield us from fluctuating world prices and give us secured energy when quite obviously even if we do produce more green energy they'll still charge us top whack to use it.

Basically doing a little bit of fibbing and manipulating the facts to suit their position. seems to be a left wing trait these days.

Yes but the renewables and green energy are owned by foreign companies, no government has control over what they charge us. Gas is sold at the global market price again we have no control over it, think it has doubled in price recently. Goes back to Thatcher selling North Sea Oil and Gas off, very short sighted.

But Ed said renewables would give us security and control over energy and lower prices.
There's more wind farms than arable or stock farms around the area now and more than half of our energy comes from renewables (secure and sustainable and cheaper according to Ed) so why isn't electricity if not gas falling in price?
Of course governments affect consumer energy prices with levies and taxes, even the petrol companies are now deflecting criticism over pump prices stating any increase in profit they make is small in comparison to the governments increased income.

The electricity trading system was devised when most electricity was produced from coal and gas stations. Operating costs included the cost of the fuel. transport costs of getting it to the power stations and the efficiency of the power stations.Electricity prices are calculated using 'system marginal pricing' where each half hour a marginal price is calculated based upon the cost of the last generator required to meet demand. Now so much of our electricity comes from renewables that pricing methodology is out of date as most renewables have zero marginal cost. There is talk of trading market reforms being required but poor Red Ed can't get his brain around it. If you sign up to some of the smart tariffs (yes you need a smart meter - don't shoot the messenger) you get half hourly pricing. Today for example its a windy day and electricity has been between 0 and 2p/kWh over the last 6 hours. At 6:30 tonight its 44p/kWh as gas plants will be running to meet demand. If you can shift when you used the bulk of your electricity for washing, tumble drier, heating etc you can save quite a bit against the default tariffs even during the current crisis.

The real issue is that most energy trading companies hedge their costs on the futures market and face losses when prices go down but make windfall profits when prices go up. Electricity generating companies and electricity supply companies are regulated. Electricity trading companies are not and many of them are based outside the UK so out of reach of UK regulators. The UK energy markets are in urgent need of fundamental reform but Ed's priority is decarbonising and any reform of electricity trading arrangements would pause decarbonisation whilst companies work out the implications.

In other words he hasn't got a fucking clue.

More succinctly put

I thought you might agree.

How can we regulate foreign and private companies who are all answerable to shareholders, when the water companies were privatised the government wiped the slate clean giving them the opportunity to update their infrastructure. What did most of them do, take on debt to pay dividends to the shareholders, water companies have a combined total debt of £80 billion. Unlike gas and electricity suppliers you can’t shop about for a better deal on your water supplier, it’s a more or less a free commodity does require being treated but a lot cheaper than extracting oil and gas.

Farage n Rishi want(Ed) the working man to pay less tax.

The public fell for Starmers lies.

We now have to wait till 2029 to stop this burglership.

Is it the two guys from 'Blackburn' who 'own' Asda?